When someone says something to me, I can choose to "feel" a certain way about what was said. I can be happy, I can be mad, I can be whatever the heck I wanna be about whatever was just said. What the person says to me has no control over my emotions. I do.
Joseph said:
"This first comforter or the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith pp. 149)
He also said:
"And he [Christ] being the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth, and having overcome, received a fulness of the glory of the Father-- possessing the same mind with the Father, which mind is the Holy Spirit, that bears record of the Father and the Son, and these three are one, or in other words these three constitute the great, matchless, governing and supreme power over all things..."(Lectures on Faith by Joseph Smith Jr. 1835; Lecture Second verse 2 pp. 53)
There is nothing here that describes and cozy, fuzzy, happy feeling you get as a confirmation from God about something. Perhaps we can react happily to a testimony from the Spirit, or in other words, mind of God; but that feeling is not the Spirititself.
Consider Nephi in 1 Nephi 4 when asked to kill Laban:
"6 And I was led by the Spirit, not knowing beforehand the things which I should do.
7 Nevertheless I went forth, and as I came near unto the house of Laban I beheld a man, and he had fallen to the earth before me, for he was drunken with wine.
8 And when I came to him I found that it was Laban.
9 And I beheld his sword, and I drew it forth from the sheath thereof; and the hilt thereof was of pure gold, and the workmanship thereof was exceedingly fine, and I saw that the blade thereof was of the most precious steel.
10 And it came to pass that I was constrained by the Spirit that I should kill Laban; but I said in my heart: Never at any time have I shed the blood of man. And I shrunk and would that I might not slay him.
11 And the Spirit said unto me again: Behold the Lord hath delivered him into thy hands. Yea, and I also knew that he had sought to take away mine own life; yea, and he would not hearken unto the commandments of the Lord; and he also had taken away our property.
12 And it came to pass that the Spirit said unto me again: Slay him, for the Lord hath delivered him into thy hands;
13 Behold the Lord slayeth the wicked to bring forth his righteous purposes. It is better that one man should perish than that a nation should dwindle and perish in unbelief.
14 And now, when I, Nephi, had heard these words, I remembered the words of the Lord which he spake unto me in the wilderness, saying that: Inasmuch as thy seed shall keep my commandments, they shall prosper in the land of promise.
15 Yea, and I also thought that they could not keep the commandments of the Lord according to the law of Moses, save they should have the law.
16 And I also knew that the law was engraven upon the plates of brass.
17 And again, I knew that the Lord had delivered Laban into my hands for this cause—that I might obtain the records according to his commandments.
18 Therefore I did obey the voice of the Spirit, and took Laban by the hair of the head, and I smote off his head with his own sword." (1Nephi 4:6-18; Emphasis added)
OKAY. I am telling you right now, Nephi did not feel fuzzy or happy about killing this jerk. He "shrunk". Cowered in fear that he might not do it. Nevertheless, Nephi, having a good acquaintance with the Voice of God, for His sheep know His voice(John 10:27) and knowing that God has his back(2 Nephi 4:18-26) sliced the guys head off and that was that. We have all the scriptures after this point because Nephi chose to follow the Lord's voice and he was greatly rewarded for the obedience(1 Ne. 11-14). Good on ya Nephi.
Consider Alma when the angel came to declare repentance to him. He says of the incident that he was "racked with eternal torment" he felt "inexpressible horror" and the "pains of a damned soul". But don't you think that the angel spoke by the Spirit? After all, angels speak by the power of the Holy Ghost (2 Nephi 32:3).
Of course, after calling upon the Lord for mercy and receiving forgiveness of his sins by the same voice that called him to repent, he felt "joy as exceeding as was [his] pain".
WE react to the Spirit.
What of D&C 84:44-45?
"44 For you shall live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God.
45 For the word of the Lord is truth, and whatsoever is truth is light, and whatsoever is light is Spirit, even the Spirit of Jesus Christ."
A=B=C=D
"Guilty take the truth to be hard"(1 Nephi 16:2) Truth =Spirit. Again, no fuzziness about this.
Now, as the whole of the Book of Mormon testifies, when we follow God's voice, His mind and will, or His Spirit despite the fact that maybe it asked us to kill our own son, lead a hard hearted people in wilderness for forty years, or declare repentance to a people who will abuse and possible kill you, we will receive something far greater than the sacrifice we are asked to make.
D&C 93:1
"Verily, thus saith the Lord: It shall come to pass that every soul who forsaketh his sins and cometh unto me, and calleth on my name, and obeyeth my voice, and keepeth my commandments, shall see my face and know that I am"
For to know Him is eternal life (John 17:3). The greatest of all God's gifts.
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thats really cool man! I just have one question. What about the fruits of the spirit in Galations 5:20? doesnt it say that the fruits of the spirit are love, peace, joy, etc. ?
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Hey man! Good question.
First I would ask the question- what is a fruit? Dont seeds have to be planted for fruit to grow? What does Alma 32 say thst the seed itself is? Doesn't the "seed" have to be buried in darkness, fight toward the surface and be nourished before fruit comes? Do some plants bare fruit faster than others?
I would next refer you back to the email and look a little closer at Alma and Nephi.
The Spirit caused them anxiety. The seed, or word, was planted in them. Despite the difficulty placed before them, they talked back, and listened, then acted. Or "let it work in them" until fruit was born and they did ineed have peace, love, joy etc. In the end.
Yes, you are right about the fruits. But the fruit is not the seed.
Just some things to ponder about.
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so if i'm understanding correctly love, joy, feelings, etc. come from the spirit but you're saying that they are not a direct fruit of it? they are just something you feel when you follow the spirit because you know you did something right not something that prompts you to do something? So with Nephi obviously the spirit doesnt send you feelings of love and joy when you are in a hazardous situation such as an event where a person is warned by the spirit he's got to do something to get your attention and help you to stop doing what you're doing or to do something differently I understand that but cant the spirit both speak with a voice of warning and cause feelings of peace and love to influence us? As for Alma, he said he was racked with eternal torment because he felt guilty of his sins. I dont think the angel specifically caused him to have those feelings I think Alma, because he was chastised so severely by the angel, started to rethink his way of living and humbled himself to the point of allowing himself to see the wrongs he'd done and thats when the eternal torment came in. correct me if i'm wrong those are just my thoughts on it all. Like when I first came to know the book of mormon was true it was a powerful experience in which I felt Love like I've never felt it before and I still havent felt love that intensely since. the same goes for when I got my second answer that the book of mormon was true. It was in winnebago YSA's apartment after you left. I literally finished reading the BOM and I went into our closet, closed the door, and prayed to know if it was true. My answer this time was not as obvious. I did feel an overwhelming peace come over me and continued with me the entire rest of that day. I feel that those experiences were no doubt the spirit manifesting itself to me. What are your thoughts?
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Hey brother, Ill get back to you when I am off work. Not quite what I am saying. Just re-read the first email. I think we have the same idea.
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okay :) will do. i'll save it then read it again next week.
so if i'm understanding correctly love, joy, feelings, etc. come from the spirit but you're saying that they are not a direct fruit of it? they are just something you feel when you follow the spirit because you know you did something right not something that prompts you to do something? So with Nephi obviously the spirit doesnt send you feelings of love and joy when you are in a hazardous situation such as an event where a person is warned by the spirit he's got to do something to get your attention and help you to stop doing what you're doing or to do something differently I understand that but cant the spirit both speak with a voice of warning and cause feelings of peace and love to influence us? As for Alma, he said he was racked with eternal torment because he felt guilty of his sins. I dont think the angel specifically caused him to have those feelings I think Alma, because he was chastised so severely by the angel, started to rethink his way of living and humbled himself to the point of allowing himself to see the wrongs he'd done and thats when the eternal torment came in. correct me if i'm wrong those are just my thoughts on it all. Like when I first came to know the book of mormon was true it was a powerful experience in which I felt Love like I've never felt it before and I still havent felt love that intensely since. the same goes for when I got my second answer that the book of mormon was true. It was in winnebago YSA's apartment after you left. I literally finished reading the BOM and I went into our closet, closed the door, and prayed to know if it was true. My answer this time was not as obvious. I did feel an overwhelming peace come over me and continued with me the entire rest of that day. I feel that those experiences were no doubt the spirit manifesting itself to me. What are your thoughts?
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Hey brother, Ill get back to you when I am off work. Not quite what I am saying. Just re-read the first email. I think we have the same idea.
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okay :) will do. i'll save it then read it again next week.
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